Mother Talkers

Homeschool Case in California

Fri Mar 07, 2008 at 11:17:07 AM PDT

The internet is already abuzz with commentary about a recent case involving a homeschooling family, where a California judge,  Justice H. Walter Croskey, wrote, "Parents do not have a constitutional right to home school their children."

And so people have taken that one line and started lining up on either side of the issue, with homeschooling advocates threatening to take it "all the way to the Supreme Court" and homeschooling foes apparently declaring some sort of victory. The defendant himself declared he believes the ruling stems from hostility against Christians and vowed to appeal to the state Supreme Court.

But when you look at the details of this case in context (which even some media didn't report), it changes the debate entirely:

LA Times

The appellate court ruling stems from a case involving Lynwood parents Phillip and Mary Long, who were repeatedly referred to the Los Angeles County Department of Children and Family Services over various allegations, including claims of physical abuse, involving some of their eight children.

All of the children are currently or had been enrolled in Sunland Christian School, where they would occasionally take tests, but were educated in their home by their mother, Phillip Long said.

A lawyer appointed to represent two of the Long's young children requested that the court require them to physically attend a public or private school where adults could monitor their well-being. A trial court disagreed, but the children's lawyer appealed to the 2nd District Court of Appeal, which has jurisdiction over Los Angeles, Ventura, Santa Barbara and San Luis Obispo counties.

The appellate panel ruled that Sunland officials' occasional monitoring of the Longs' home schooling -- with the children taking some tests at the school -- is insufficient to qualify as being enrolled in a private school. Since Mary Long does not have a teaching credential, the family is violating state laws, the ruling said.

"Parents do not have a constitutional right to home school their children," wrote Justice H. Walter Croskey in a Feb. 28 opinion signed by the two other members of the district court. "Parents who fail to [comply with school enrollment laws] may be subject to a criminal complaint against them, found guilty of an infraction, and subject to imposition of fines or an order to complete a parent education and counseling program."

  • ::

So rather than being a test case of the noble homeschooler, instead this is a case of kids who have been referred for child abuse, and whose court-appointed attorney has asked the court to insist that the kids physically attend school. Note that in California, daily physical attendance isn't always required to be enrolled in a public school - there are many charter and public schools set up for virtual schooling or independent study. These kids are in fact enrolled in a private school, but were not attending regularly. The parents' defense is that they are 'homeschooling' so their kids cannot be forced to attend.

California regulations don't really allow parents to just teach their kids on their own - but in practice, kids are homeschooled all over the state, and schools aren't bothering them. Heck, one wonders how a school would even know if there were kids in a household if they had never attended school. In my area, there are quite a few homeschoolers, and the ones I meet seem to do quite well by their kids. In many cases here, the reasons are logistical: the family lives far from the school (perhaps impassible in heavy weather), the family travels a lot, etc. Some do for religious reasons. Some because they think they can do better. Some because there's been a conflict with a teacher or another student at school. There's a group of homeschooling families that get together to help each other out, which I think is great. Kids learn in different ways, and as long as they're learning, I'm good with that. I don't think it's in the interest of schools to interfere with that - indeed, I've seen our school stay friendly with homeschooling families, to the ultimate benefit of both.

It will be unfortunate if this case is seen as a precedent, and if various proxies feel the need to get involved. Truly, this is a case about child protective services, not about homeschooling, and I hope some of the people who are letting the rhetoric flow step back and let the case go back to its former obscurity. Let's face it - no one, not even homeschooling advocates, want to make the case that parents should be allowed to do anything at all that they want to their children without supervision. Homeschooling is not intended to be used to hide abuse.

PDF file of the judge's decision

Tags: homeschooling, education, California, child abuse (all tags)

Permalink | 52 comments

  • bad law (0 / 0)

    I do not think homeschooling is my cup of tea but here, the law is bad, and maybe someone can explain it to me?

    California regulations don't really allow parents to just teach their kids on their own

    why the heck not? You can make a lot of arguments against it, but the fact appears to be that

    Parents do not have a constitutional right to home school their children

    My question is, why shouldn't they? Any law that tells me how to parent isn't one I'm terribly fond of.

    • Should parents have a right to not school kids? (0 / 0)

      Parents do not have a constitutional right to home school their children

      My question is, why shouldn't they? Any law that tells me how to parent isn't one I'm terribly fond of.

      Should parents have a right to just let their children play and not try to teach them anything? Do they have a right to just leave them in the garden all day?
      No, they don't. It's an almost comically extreme example, but it makes the point: Children have a right to an education, and anyone who stands in the way of that, be they school districts not accommodating special needs, or parents not bothering to teach children, will get steamrollered over. And rightly so.
      Now how the children get that education is to a degree left up to the parents, and that includes homeschooling, but if children have a right to an education, then the state has a right to enforce standards upon parents who choose to homeschool. I don't think requiring some form of teaching qualification (how hard are they to come by in CA, out of interest, anyone know?) is an unreasonable requirement if a parent is going to be responsible for their child's education.

      "You're never more alone than when you're alone in a crowd."

      by Expat Briton on Fri Mar 07, 2008 at 12:39:18 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      • I completely disagree (0 / 0)

        because i don't think you can regulate how someone GETS an education, or even the definition of "education". My Sister in Law believes in unschooling. It's what she practices with her kids. Do I think that it's working or even beneficial? Not really. But yeah, if a parent decides for whatever reason that school is not the answer, then there you go.

        And while it's utopian to believe that it's a right for children to have AN education, class, community make-up and poverty levels dictate the level of this education, and it varies so vastly from state to state, community to community, that creating a law that says "you must have your child attend school" is a bad bad law, IMO.

        • Do you believe that kids have any rights? (0 / 0)

          Or just parents? Some people feel only parents.

          • Wow, I really don't know. (0 / 0)

            I think that kids have rights, but...huh. Good question. What would you define as "rights?" Matybe I DON'T think they do! huh, that would surprise me...

            I think if my niece was seriously determined to go to school, made her feelings known, and her mom told her "tough luck kid," I'd have a hard time being supportive of that.

        • Disagree completely. (0 / 0)

          That educational provisions are bad isn't an excuse for legalising negligence. In the end, if children don't receive a sufficient education, they become everybody's problem, because society has to support them. Additionally, I think children have an absolute right to be prepared for adulthood, and if they receive an insufficient or nonexistant education, that's not happening. It is absolutely in their interest that their education be regulated and mandated. Anything less is an abdication of the state's responsibility, IMO.

          "You're never more alone than when you're alone in a crowd."

          by Expat Briton on Fri Mar 07, 2008 at 01:48:49 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          • regulated and mandated education (0 / 0)

            based on governmental standards, where children will be taught exactly what the "government" wants them to learn- where parents have no right to say "this is not how I want my child to learn?" Standards that require a child to meet certain criteria based on age and not much else? Complete control over a huge aspect of your child's rearing and raising be regulated?

            NO THANKS. That sounds terrifying, to be honest. And I don't buy the whole "these kids won't be useful to society! We will have to take care of them" line. The kid that plays in the garden all day has ever chance of growing up and becoming an organic farmer or whatever the hell he or she wants to be. The path may be harder, it maybe limiting, but hell, it's their path.

            And the concept that it is NEGLIGENT to not send your kid to an instructional school is one I do not buy into either. Your definition of negligence sure ain't mine, and for that reason alone I think legislating schooling is bad bad bad.

            • asdf (0 / 0)

              Th

              e kid that plays in the garden all day has ever chance of growing up and becoming an organic farmer or whatever the hell he or she wants to be

              Oh, c'mon, M, that's just so not true. If a kid does not have literacy and numeracy, they will not ever be an organic farmer just because they played in the garden. My cousin's in laws are third generation farmers, organic and all, and they all have college degrees. Running a farm is running a very complicated business: the technical aspect, the employees, labor law, tax law, and regulation. And god knows what else.  

              I know you didn't mean it literally. My point is that not getting the basics ruins - completely -  a kid's ability to have a stable life, because they just won't be able to get a job, even in a service industry. At some point it becomes impossible to turn it around.

              I think you are picturing everybody having middle class sensibilities and decision-making, like you, only plus or minus.  Even your sister in law is probably in the plus or minus range. That's just not the way it is for some kids, and they need someone other than their parents to help them.

              • homeschooling (0 / 0)

                I guess I'm looking at this in the context of home schooling (or unschooling) where kids are not neglected or abused, they are just not in school. I don't see these types of kids automatically growing up to be illiterate or lacking basic math skills (i mean, their parents BUY things right?!?!)

                So if you have a kid whose parents make the CHOICE not to send them to school, to let them play in the garden all day, well, odds are it's not a NEGLECT situation (child completely alone, with no learning in a dark room.) So unless the parents of that kid are completely cut off from society and never have any interaction with the skills a functioning adult needs day to day, then no, they won't learn ANYTHING. But learning and adapting is inherent. It just is. And the kids of those random hermits in the middle of nowhere, they aren't really a concern so much, eh? :)

                My nieces are not at the head of the class. But they write stories and read voraciously and know basic math skills. They don't have a curriculum and they don't go to school, and I don't really wanna live in a state that says they have to take tests (because homeschooling is generally anti-test, which makes any sort of regulating testing inherently unfair to a child who has learned differently) or PROVE their learning to anyone.

        • Question to you (0 / 0)

          This isn't snark.  The truth is that I really love the idea of unschooling and think school sucks.  However, I also believe that children need to be prepared to live in the world we live in.  

          At my very progressive high school, one teacher had a vision of sort of unschooling within school (letting kids follow whatever they wanted to do and learn different skills as they went along).  Trouble was, it didn't meet state requirements for high school graduation.  He started his program anyway.  Another teacher would ask "how can someone who makes $20 dollars an hour decide it's alright to send his students out to make $5 an hour?"

          Long lead in, but my question to you is, would you think that if parents choose not to educate their children in a way that prepares them to live in our world, should those parents then be required to keep their kids on the family payroll into adulthood?

          • Sure... if (0 / 0)

            the parents of the kid in my DH's class who is getting a 7% because he doesn't do anything, take notes or pay attention has to pay. And if the parents of the athletes who pass class because they do well in their sports but can't read have to pay.

            So no, I think that's absurd. It'd be like this: you turn 18, you have to register with the state and take an IQ and competency test. If you fail this test, well, your parents must have failed you and are therefor required to take care of you for the rest of their lives and after they pass you can... go be homeless? I mean, honestly, how else would you even remotely consider a process that declares "well, if you don't send your kid to school they become your financial burden" would work?

            Let's all not be so pretentious as to assume that homeschooling or even unschooling somehow equates no education, no skills AND thinking that attending school is somehow a guarantee of an educated, well prepared person.

      • To get a CA teaching credential (0 / 0)

        A CA teaching credential is one full year (sometimes more, depending on how the program is structured) of post graduate work through either the University of California (and I think only a couple of campuses even offer it anymore, and it is in conjunction with a masters, last I checked) or the California State University system. Or a private university, which would be incredibly expensive, 20K ish. It includes student teaching. I do not know if credentials are somehow offered online, somehow I doubt it could be done 100% online.

        K- 8 credentials are separate from secondary credentials. Special ed is a separate credential.

        So this would be impossible for many families, either financially, or they live too far away from a campus. It is definitely not something you can do on the spur of the moment.

        Plus that CBEST test, but it's quite easy actually. If you can't pass it, it would be hard to say it's ok to teach.

        • That does seem like setting the bar high. (0 / 0)

          I'd be in favour of having some form of homeschooling test administered by the state, to make sure parents are capable, and I don't think I'd allow homeschooling past probably 5th grade, but a year's course seems pretty extreme.

          "You're never more alone than when you're alone in a crowd."

          by Expat Briton on Fri Mar 07, 2008 at 01:50:32 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          • Yes, I would think (0 / 0)

            have some training, and a test, to where you could either prove your skills or get trained.  Then again, why should we believe everyone can be teachers?  I don't think it should be hard to become one, but there are standards for the profession.  Why should homeschooling be allowed to dilute that?

      • teacheing ceritification (0 / 0)

        to actually teach at a school is 2 years and the CBEST and CSET.  I could see making sure the parent is at least as qualified as a substitute, though (bachelor's and passing the CBEST) because, for example, how on earth can you teach high-school if you didn't graduate?

    • practice v. theory (0 / 0)

      It's worth remembering that in actual practice, Californians do homeschool their children all the time.

      This case came to court because the parents were suspected of abusing and neglecting their children. Getting them in school was a way to monitor that.

      Where in the constitution does it give you the right to homeschool? If there were such a right, wouldn't all the laws about compulsory education be unconstitutional?

      It's worth pointing out that California could choose to add more statutes that explicitly address homeschooling, and it's also worth remembering that in addition to informal homeschooling, that in California there are charter schools set up for online learning and also charter schools that are independent study, in both cases with materials furnished by the state. In addition, if you want, you can go to your local school and set yourself up for independent study, get counted as part of the enrollment, and in exchange get free books, materials, and curricula.

  • I'm confused now (0 / 0)

    I just read about this in the SF Chronicle, and their article also covered the child abuse aspect. But it also said the ruling slapped a bunch of requirements on homeschooling parents, which is throwing everybody in turmoil.

    I have no opinion either way about homeschooling, but the requirements did seem designed to get almost all homeschooling kids back in the classroom. Or at least re-structure homeschooling radically. According to the article, it is still legal to hire a credentialed tutor to do the homeschooling. Anyway, here are some of the new requirements for the teacher-parents of homeschools:

    *college degree or more from accredited college
    *post graduate teaching credential, including student teaching
    *pass the CBEST (test of basic skills for CA teachers)
    *a course in how to use computers in an educational setting
    *course in language arts and math (how to teach them)
    *course in the US constitution.

    I think I got most of those right. If this is true, I can't imagine how most parents are going to meet the requirements, esp. the full teaching credential bit.

    So what's the real story, I wonder.

    • Wow! (0 / 0)

      That's a lot of requirements that certainly seems to be aimed at reducing homeschooling dramatically.

      Our state has zero requirements. Nada.  You don't have to register, take tests, show that you're doing anything, nothing.  I'm kind of against no requirements, but I'm not that familiar with what would be reasonable.

      I don't have an opinion on homeschooling either.  I think homeschooling can be done well, or horribly.  Same for traditional schooling.

      • Aimed at reducing homeschooling (0 / 0)

        or aimed at getting children a decent education?  

        Homeschooling isn't my thing, as I think it has great potential for stunting kids socially.  But I've also thought, what parents are qualified to teach every subject, k-12?  Don't home schooled kids have as much right to a well-rounded education as anyone?

        • requirements (0 / 0)

          Post-college teaching experience?  Do you really need that to teach your own children at home?  A course in how to use computers?  Eh.

          I agree that not every parent can teach every subject K-12.  But many home schoolers know that and outsource appropriately.

          • Well... (0 / 0)

            I guess I could see relaxing some of the regulations if each family was re-evaluated at the beginning of every school year.  Maybe it's done that way, I have no idea.  With parents proving that either they or whoever they outsource to will provide kids with what they would (or should) receive in school.

            But I do think teaching is its own skill, independent or the subject matter, so yes, post-college teaching skills are one of the only ways I can think of for a parent to show that, yes, I can teach.  The fact that they are teaching their own children doesn't seem relevant to me, because don't we own our own children as much as we would own someone else's?  I think homeschooling parents need to be equally as qualified as a teacher.

            I know I'm sounding very anti-homeschool, and the truth is I'm not.  It's just  that I think that it would be difficult to provide in a way that meets the standards that it should.  I know that there are amazing homeschooling parents out there, but I worry about the ones who miss the mark.

            • teaching (0 / 0)

              I think teaching in a classroom is its own skill and teaching one-on-one is its own skill.  Part of student teaching is learning how to teach a large group of students.  With homeschooling, you're never teaching 20 or 30 kids all at once.

              I used to tutor kids one-on-one, and I was quite good at it.  It's a total different animal than classroom teaching, which I have also done.

              I agree that homeschooling should meet certain standards, as should all schools. But there are lots of bad schools, lots of good ones, and probably the same for hs'ing parents.

        • I agree (0 / 0)

          Maybe those two things mean the same thing :).

          Homeschooling doesn't really push buttons with me, but I do agree with everything you've said. If anybody asked me to make the decision with a magic wand, I would put pretty much those requirements in place. Plus a requirement showing science literacy and literacy in advanced math.  And a requirement for extracurriculars with groups of other kids??

          There are a lot of courses that you can buy online, for k-12. But I think it takes more savvy  - not to mention money - than most people have to devise an entire education for a kid.

      • No requirements (0 / 0)

        That is surprising. I definitely feel it should be monitored somehow, esp for those homeschooling for many years. There are always going to be some families doing really wacky stuff (like refusing to teach evolution) or worse, and that's not fair to those kids.

        The article also said that it's going to be fight, legally. So who knows what will really happen in the end.

        • evolution (0 / 0)

          The Christian homeschool movement was founded in part in order to avoid having their kids exposed to other "values," including evolution.  I'm not sure those families are particularly "out there" in the homeschool community.

        • no regulation (0 / 0)

          as far as I know in IL. And I like it that way thankyouverymuch.

          Like most of us here, I'm not into the homeschooling concept. But my Sister in law is at the homeschooler's conference right this minute with her 3 day old and her 2 daughters, networking and talking with other parents who do it. She's a unschooler (link above) but is a bit more structured in some areas. She feels it works, and I would fight any law that tried to tell her otherwise.

          Do I think my niece are getting a stellar education? Nope. But neither are the kids in downtown Aurora, IL. So before we get anywhere near a regulation that requires kids stay in school, howzabout we make sure the schools are safe, functional, and actually serve their purposes? Also, I want the law out of my parenting decisions. I'm not talking about how you're supposed to feed your kids, and not abuse them- that's so different. I had no idea some states actually had regulations for homeschooling. That's infuriating, IMO.

          • No requirements in Ky either (0 / 0)

            And although I certainly believe that most homeschoolers are giving their children reasonable educations and networking with other homeschoolers, increasing the breadth of the educational experience-- there are always a few who spoil the privilege.  I have one aunt who homeschooled because there was suspicion of child abuse and she got tired of the school calling CPS.  I believe she was absolutely abusing her child.  Another aunt, who barely graduated from high school is homeschooling her son b/c of the evolution issue.  She probably does as well as a public school in the lower percentiles.  Clearly these two women have differing opinions of what their children need as far as education-- and their opinions certainly differ from mine.  And, unfortunately, their children will suffer.  No doubt about it.  But how do we check up on one of them and not the other?

            "We've GOT to make noises in greater amounts! So, open your mouth, lad! For every voice counts!"

            by progressiveinky on Sat Mar 08, 2008 at 08:00:12 AM PDT

            [ Parent ]

    • the ruling itself didn't impose new requirements (0 / 0)

      The law has been on the books for decades and has always been interpreted to prohibit homeschooling by non-credentialed teachers.  The court was following previous decisions saying the same thing.  

      Whether or not the law is a good idea is worth discussing.  And whether or not the law applies to tiny "private schools" that some parents set up to home school their children is also another issue.  

      But it is not a new law and these requirements have existed for years.

      • So it's just not enforced? (0 / 0)

        I can see how homeschoolers and private schools might get worried if a little enforced law starts to get a lot of attention.

        • Right. It's just not enforced. (0 / 0)

          Further, there's no reason to believe that this ruling will change that. This ruling only applies to two children, whose attorney is asking for a specific schooling situation for them. For it to apply to anyone else, someone has to bring a court case. No one is doing that. No one is going door to door and reporting homeschooled kids and taking them to court.

          The legislature certainly has the option to clarify the issue by statute, if they wish.

  • I rushed through (0 / 0)

    reading the post, but it seems like the most important part of this case is the fact that there are reports of abuse?  I like the idea of keeping children in the home if possible, but monitoring questionable parents.  Requiring the children to be present in school so that other adults can lay eyes on them seems like a great solution to me.  I agree with Shenanigans that this is about child abuse and should not be used to set any sort of precedent about homeschooling.

    By the by, I've always wondered, can adults sue their parents, either criminally or civilly, for childhood abuse?  At the time of the crime they were helpless.  I never hear about adults doing this, but I would very much support it (I'm not a lawsuit-phobe).

    • Interesting question (0 / 0)

      Actually I would support it also. Some parental behavior is way out of any gray area, so why not.

      I remember reading a long time ago about a kid, early teens, who with the help of his CPS lawyer was suing to legally divorce his parents, basically to emancipate himself before the legal age. I believe he was trying to find some way that his foster family could adopt him.

  • private schools (0 / 0)

    often hire non-credentialed teachers.  Where I live, there are very few credentialed teachers working in the parochial schools, for example.  This kind of ruling would affect more than homeschoolers.

    • Yes (0 / 0)

      The article in the Chron (I tried to post the link, but you have to subscribe, a pain) mentioned charters and private schools being vulnerable. It was indeed a front page story with giant letters that I spotted from many feet away, for this reason.

  • Haven't read it all, yet. (0 / 0)

    Don't know if I'll get the chance, but the court's ruling can be found here (pdf link).

    "You're never more alone than when you're alone in a crowd."

    by Expat Briton on Fri Mar 07, 2008 at 01:02:47 PM PDT

    • Obviously I missed the link above. (0 / 0)

      Whoops. Decision looks good, but I'm hardly an expert. A couple of quotes:

      a substantial body of case law has confirmed the power of the States to insist that attendance at private schools, if it is to satisfy state compulsory-attendance laws, be at institutions which provide minimum hours of instruction, employ teachers of specified training, and cover prescribed subjects of instruction. Indeed, the State’s interest in assuring that these standards are being met has been considered a sufficient reason for refusing to accept instruction at home as compliance with compulsory education statutes. These cases were a sensible corollary of Pierce v. Society of Sisters: if the State must satisfy its interest in secular
      education through the instrument of private schools, it has a proper interest in the manner in which those schools perform their secular educational function." (Id., 392 U.S. at pp. 245-247, fns. omitted.) The Allen court cited Turner as a case in which home instruction was rejected as a means of complying with a state’s compulsory
      education laws.

      As far as Federal law and US constitutional law is concerned, there's no question - states have the right to regulate education, but must give parents a choice. As the states have an interest in regulating standards, and because it would be impossible to visit and check a large number of homes, there's no requirement to allow home schooling, however. They do have to allow private schools because parents have to have a choice, and checking schools wouldn't be as onerous a task as checking individual homes.
      There's no California constitutional question here, so it just comes down to what California law says. And CA law says you have to have a teaching qualification of a qualified tutor if you're going to home school. That seems to be the guts of the decision. Seems reasonable to me.

      Incidentally, it does seem like under the first amendment, there's a right to pull your children out of normal education if you have a religious objection, but the bar is set high to prove that that's the case (from a case involving the Amish). Just saying so isn't good enough. And even then, you have to show that children will get some form of education that'll be appropriate to their future life.

      "You're never more alone than when you're alone in a crowd."

      by Expat Briton on Fri Mar 07, 2008 at 01:44:59 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  • NO!!! (0 / 0)

    Parents don't have the constitutional right to raise their children, let alone educate them.  The state has a compelling interest in protecting children; they are not property to use as you please.  You abuse them, you lose them.

    I'm all for freedom of educational choice, but there are limits.  Once the judgment has been made that the children's welfare is at risk then the state can and should step in.  Personally I'm glad to see that they are taking steps to make sure the kids are OK without disrupting the family.

    • apples and oranges (0 / 0)

      I absolutely agree with your point- you abuse, you lose. And that's why it's a damn shame this is a story of abuse and not schooling really. But keeping your kids home and unschooling them is in NO WAY abuse. So to have a law that says "you cannot make that choice" I think is appalling.

      • There's no change in the law (0 / 0)

        The law has been what it's been for 30 years.

        I think the problem has been that to write it to loosen the standards without making them too loose is problematic - thus, the status quo which is that technically you must elect for supervision, but unofficially, we won't bother you unless you appear to be in eggregious violation.

  • To me, there are two different standards (0 / 0)

    The first is elementary school.  Practically all parents could teach the basics.  (But what about getting along with other students, etc.  This is a big part of school, IMO.  Many home-schooling parents say, "Well, we get together with other families, so our kids can do this."  Yeah, but who do you get together with?  Answer:  All you approve of.  What about problem children?  "Ah!" you say.  "I don't want my kids around them!"  What happens when they get to high school, in the work world?  How can they cope with anyone that different than them?)

    The second part is Jr. High/Middle School and High School.  What parent could do this?  How many people do you know who could teach Chemistry and Sociology and Economics, etc.?  These courses are specialized.  I can't think of anyone who could teach all high school classes.

    Can you tell I am not for home-schooling?  I am NOT for banning it, but I wouldn't have my children in it.  (And this said by a parent who home-taught her youngest child his last 2 years.  But that's another story.)

    • A FAQ on homeschooling high school aged kids (0 / 0)

      Q: ZOMG, math is hard! What parent could teach Chemistry and Sociology and Economics?

      A: By the time they're high school aged, most homeschoolers are doing some kinds of academic work either in depth on their own, or in an outside setting. There are online classes. Parents band together to teach homeschooling classes, sometimes hiring a teacher. Lots of homeschoolers take classes at local four year colleges and community colleges. Parents hire tutors.

      And plenty of parents are capable of teaching Chemistry and Sociology and Economics. I taught my son microeconomics. He got a 5 (highest score) on the AP Micro exam his "freshman year."

      Bonus Q: What about the prom?

      A: Why would my son need to go to school not to go the prom? He can not go to the prom as a homeschooler just as easily.

  • Browsing the right-wing blogs on this subject (0 / 0)

    I am amused by how many cries I've come across of "activist judges"  and that people have a right to do whatever they want with their kids. No one has cited a legal argument for where exactly a constitutional right to homeschool would come from (and the judge's actual ruling makes it obvious that indeed he is well within precedent). Hmm. What exactly happened to strict constructionism and states' rights again?

  • Schwarzenegger (0 / 0)

    Interestingly, the governor frames this as a parents' rights issue.  He said yesterday that he will try to protect homeschooling as is.

    This outrageous ruling must be overturned by the courts and if the courts don't protect parents' right then, as elected officials, we will.

    • There's a gem of a quote from the father (0 / 0)

      in the sfgate version of that article:

      "A credentialed teacher ain't gonna come and educate my child for free," Long said.

      Meanwhile, at least some of the homeschoolers seem to have relaxed and are saying maybe they don't want a new law that sanctions (and thus regulates) homeschooling:

      There is no provision in the California Education Code or elsewhere in state law that addresses the issue of homeschooling. Homeschool advocates want to keep it that way, despite the governor's support for a new law to help them.

      They believe current code supports their practices and that new laws would include regulations and possibly restrictions on homeschooling.

      "We just want to leave it alone because it's good the way it is," said Loren Mavromati, who homeschools her two children and volunteers with the California Homeschool Network, an advocacy organization made up mostly of homeschooling parents. "The law as it stands is working well in California."

      The case law as cited by the ruling judge looks pretty rock solid. Remember, in that case, which is a child abuse proceeding, the children's attorney is asking for a particular kind of school arrangement, one where they attend 5 days a week, which is more restrictive than is required by the state. His declaration that there's no "constitutional right" to homeschooling won't be overturned. But, there's also no reason that a wave of court cases will begin because of it.

      • Missing the point (0 / 0)

        Shenanigans, I think you're not understanding why homeschoolers are up in arms about this decision.

        None of the big homeschooling organizations object to the ruling as applied to this particular family. There are allegations of serious problems including sexual abuse, and the state is right to be involved with the kids. That's not the problem.

        But the court went further. It said that the way that most California homeschoolers are homeschooling is illegal, and their children are truant. Those homeschoolers thought they were following the law. Now they discover that, if this decision stands, they are at the mercy of any vengeful local school superintendent or nasty neighbor. Any school district hostile to homeschooling, and there are quite a few of them, could take all the local homeschoolers to court and force them to send their children to school.

        Loren Mavromati is not saying that she approves of the current ruling; she's saying she liked the previous situation, where the applicable laws were interpreted as permitting homeschooling. The two secular state homeschooling organizations, Homeschool Association of California and the California Homeschool Network, now have some high-powered lawyers working pro bono to "depublish" this decision so it cannot be used as a precedent.

        • I don't think I am (0 / 0)

          The fact is that this has been the law all along and it is how any judge would have ruled at any time had a case been brought. For all the handwringing about "activist" judges, in fact all a judge is supposed to do is interpret the law, and California law is very clear and always has been.

          Homeschoolers have been vulnerable all along to their local school district bringing court action. What has changed for them from this ruling? Nothing, except that it's more obvious to everyone. I doubt any superintendent or principal has been ignorant of this. Trust me, they know the education code inside and out. But, they've also quite wisely understood that an action like that would cost them more money than it would net, plus an astounding amount of goodwill.

          No one has ever said there was a constitutional right to homeschooling. And whether or not this particular ruling is depublished, all the case law it is based on, and all the statutes it is based on, remain. (Asking to have it depublished is probably still worthwhile for them.) If you read the actual decision, you'll see that there is no reaching by the judge here.

          So homeschooling advocates have a couple of choices:

          1. Sit back, and see if there's a new flurry of prosecutions. If not, let the ruling fade from everyone's mind and go back to the status quo.
          1. Work to create a homeschooling statute - which necessarily is going to include some oversight and more scrutiny than is present now.

          Remember that any change in the law has to work not only for kids who are taught by good, caring, capable parents but also for kids with parents who are too lazy to get up in time to put the kids on the bus and do nothing at home for their education, or kids whose parents 'homeschool' to isolate and abuse them, as in this case.

          • I pick Door Number 3 (0 / 0)

            1. Have the decision depublished. Wait for a better case which will end in a better precedent.

            That's the tactic homeschooling advocates are now using. If it fails, then we'll have to work for legislation, but that is perilous given that there are a lot of Democrats in the legislature who get strong support from the teachers union, which hates homeschooling.

            Sitting back and hoping that no more homeschoolers get prosecuted is not a strategy that state homeschooling organizations can or should get behind.

            • That's actually door #1 :-) (0 / 0)

              Because basically, that's sitting around and waiting for another case, which could be next year, or it could be 10 years or more.

              But seriously: after reading the case law, and the statute, how do you expect a judge to decide differently? Constitutional law and precedent give states wide latitude in how they regulate schooling. If the California statute says that students have to be under the supervision of a registered school or a credentialed teacher, that's the law. This provision was tested in 1953 (People v. Turner and its appeals) and found constitutional.

              If having this overhead is too much, there needs to be a change to the statute.

              • There are other cases and other statutes (0 / 0)

                If the California statute says that students have to be under the supervision of a registered school or a credentialed teacher, that's the law.

                But the students in this case were under the supervision of a registered school. They were students at Sunland.

  • NY has regulations (0 / 0)

    Homeschooling parents are required to file individualized homeschooling plans with their local school districts, submit quarterly reports and have their children assessed by a qualified teacher at the end of the fourth quarter.  The state also specifies which subjects must be taught at each grade level.

    This seems reasonable.  It assures that there isn't educational neglect but the parents do not have to get teaching certificates.

Permalink | 52 comments