Mother Talkers

The Paperwork of Life

Mon Feb 25, 2008 at 09:12:17 AM PDT

When our son was born my husband was finishing graduate school while working full time and I was also in school.  With one income it became clear to us that we needed to protect our family in case of the unthinkable.  

We immediately bought additional life insurance.  Our wonderful representative came to our home and worked with us on buying the policies.  We increased the policies we already had on ourselves and we bought a small insurance policy on our brand new little boy.  And it was weird to be almost "planning" for his death so early in his life.  But everyone said, "The last thing you want to think about in a bad situation is how to pay for his funeral and your own time off because you would be too devastated to go to work."  And then DH and I got right to work on our wills.  Well, sort of.

We made an appointment with an attorney, we paid the rather large (for us) fee to get things rolling.  The attorney talked to us about trust funds, guardianship, living wills, how to set things up to avoid estate taxes, etc.  It was overwhelming!  

We received the packet of wills a few months after seeing the attorney and tried a few times to get through the legalese.  We'd work on it for an hour or so, get distracted, and not get back to it for quite a while.  We are very close to having it all settled.  All we have to do is approve what's in the document, send the remaining portion of the money due, and the attorneys will fix us up.  

Today when I saw this article in my local newspaper about a woman who didn't have her affairs in order, I was shaken to the core.  Of course, this woman's situation is different from mine.  She was on her third marriage, there are grown children and step-children involved.  I'm sure any of us can imagine how a situation like that could get sticky.

But what about a custody situation with minor children?  When we told my relatives that we'd chosen my husband's sister to be our son's guardian in case of our simultaneous deaths, they were outraged.  I ended up telling them they didn't get a vote.  But if we didn't have our wills complete by the time something happened to us, who knows what legal battles my son may have to endure at the hands of "well meaning" relatives.  Not to mention the situation being further complicated by the large life insurance policies that go with him.

It is rare when both parents die together.  But in the case discussed in this article, multiple married couples lost their lives in that same accident.  Personally, I will be reading over and signing that will this week.  It's been sitting for far too long.

Poll

Do you have a will

46%18 votes
5%2 votes
7%3 votes
38%15 votes
2%1 votes

| 39 votes | Vote | Results

Tags: wills, custody, life insurance (all tags)

Permalink | 20 comments

  • Recommendation (0 / 0)

    I highly recommend getting a book on wills from Nolo Press.  I got "Make your own living trust" (or something like that), which comes with a CD of forms and step by step instructions.

    We did not make our own trust, we had a lawyer draw it up.  But the clear, simple workbook had led us through all sorts of issues that would never have occurred to us, that we needed to discuss and make decisions about.  By the time we got to the lawyer's office we were prepared and knew which questions we needed to focus on.  

    I definitely think the lawyer was worth it.  But for maybe $20 we got a great education, plus we probably saved a couple of hours of expensive lawyer time.  Awesome book.

  • DH and I are bad about much related to paperwork (0 / 0)

    But we are really good about this. My mother's affairs were a MESS when she died and I was her executor. I would never want to inflict that on anyone else. Plus, with the kids being so little, I just don't like to take any chances.

    We are insured up the wazoo and had a really good estate lawyer do our wills and POAs. We also have advanced care directives. We actually took care of all this when I was pregnant with our older son and had the wills drawn up so that they would work if we had more children.

    I have friends and relations with young children

    • Oops (0 / 0)

      didn't finish my thought there. I was going to say that I know people with young children who haven't done this and it really surprises me. I guess I'm just not that much of an optimist!

  • Very important (0 / 0)

    and we have not gotten this done.  The subject came up at church the other day, about making sure your kids would be raised by someone who shares your values.

  • We actually downloaded forms, filled them out (0 / 0)

    and had them notarized.  We checked in with a lawyer who said that since we don't have a large estate (ha!  That's an understatement!) this is just fine for us.  Living wills, advanced directives, the whole nine yards including guardianship of the kids.  My sister holds duplicate originals (we made two sets of everything) and said it was "weird" to hold my will in her hands.  I told her it was weirder to hold it in my own hands.

    It feels good to have it done, though.

  • No will here (0 / 0)

    Plenty of life insurance, though. We just figure the laws of inheritance are what we want anyway-- if we both die, everything goes to DS, and if DS dies, we really don't care who gets what. We talked to my sister and her husband about raising DS in the event of our untimely demise, and she's very cool with that, and DH's sibs and family likely wouldn't fight it (hell, we can't even get MIL to babysit).

    I don't get weirded out by planning for death. I supposed I should put this all in some official document at some point, but as long as the life insurance on everyone is paid up, my mind is at ease.

  • We were told that the court decides (0 / 0)

    who will raise our children if we didn't have it in a legal document.  We subscribed to DH's legal benefit and had an attorney draw up all the wills (including who would raise our minor children), living trust, and all of that.

    We didn't know what we were doing, and the attorney was terrible at explaining.  I think the Nolo Press book is a great idea.  Maybe we'll do that when we decide to update everything.

    I would say that belief in the courts to do the right thing is a little naive.  Don't assume your chosen person would get custody of your minor children unless you have it in a legal document.  What if a a legal nightmare ensues and your beloved child(ren) end up in foster care?  It might work out in the end, but shuffling would be so traumatic for children who have already suffered the loss of both parents.  

  • Done before ds was born (0 / 0)

    I rarely pitch a fit to insist that something get done, but I did in order to get wills and guardianship and life insurance worked out before ds was born. Dh was dragging his feet, but no way would I want this to not be worked out by us in the event of a tragedy.

    So we have guardianship worked out, and the money stuff worked out. I ran our guardianship plan (dh's sister) by my mom so that she wouldn't feel bad or surprised. She readily agreed that she and my dad were too old to be named guardians - too high of a risk that ds would lose them while still a minor (if he were to lose us).

    When ds is a mid teen, we'll do another guardianship plan, to, for example, allow him to stay in his high school if something were to happen to us.

  • I sort of smile at this... (0 / 0)

    The will that we've not yet completed puts everything into a trust for DS (currently 3) and he gets interest payments only until he's 65. I figure that way he can subsidize any lifestyle he wants.  If he wants to be an artist and it won't pay all the bills-- he's subsidized. My best friend (who is a trustfund baby herself) thought this was just terrible.  I like knowing he'll really be taken care of and that he won't be one of those kids who blows it all in a year.  He can take money out of the trust only for education and medical expenses prior to 65.

    "We've GOT to make noises in greater amounts! So, open your mouth, lad! For every voice counts!"

    by progressiveinky on Mon Feb 25, 2008 at 02:06:25 PM PDT

    • 65?? (0 / 0)

      Yikes, because when he's 40 or 45, you don't think he would be enough of an adult? Ouch.

      We went the common step-wise route of 1. can take out for college or other schooling starting at 18, with the permission of his two executors. 2. gets a chunk under his control when he is 30 and 3. the rest when he is 35.

      Why 65 anyway? Could you say he never gets control of it, and neither do his future kids? It just sounds so controlling, sorry to be so shocked. There are so many scenarios where having access to the full amount might be the best decision for him and his future family.

      • Plus (0 / 0)

        If your son is not able to access the principal of the trust, who is going to do the investment and management of that money? Do you feel confident that the investment strategy you've worked out will be the best one for the next 62 years? The executors are going to pass away at some point, too.

        If your lawyer has other advice about this, please consider it. I've just never heard of such a thing.

        Ok, mouth zippered shut now.

        • It came from the attorney and experience (0 / 0)

          The attorney recommended that the trust holders be an institution, overseen by a family member, and eventually my son can influence the investments (at 18).  My best friend got large chunks of money at various times throughout her life and I've seen her (and multiple others in the same situation) sitting around waiting for it.  She doesn't feel she needs to do anything b/c she knows that in 5-10 years she's got more coming.  After one installment she spent $8000 on clothes in a year!  She has no idea how to take care of herself and find her own way.  And when she gets a chunk (and she's in her mid-30's and was 30 when the money started coming) of change, she blows it all!  Then she's roughing it until the next installment.  

          "We've GOT to make noises in greater amounts! So, open your mouth, lad! For every voice counts!"

          by progressiveinky on Tue Feb 26, 2008 at 07:10:21 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

    • Longevity (0 / 0)

      You must have long life-spans in your family.  When I see "65", I think of my Dad who died at 68.  In your plan, the majority of funds would have gone to my Mom- unless he spent them all in 3 years!

      • 65 is young for us, I suppose (0 / 0)

        Most of the men in our family live until at least 80, and sometimes well into the 90's.  This way he can do his thing and live his life on his own and then he gets a reward in retirement.  If he falls on hard times he can have money for education or medical or living expenses while in school or while unable to work due to medical problems.

        "We've GOT to make noises in greater amounts! So, open your mouth, lad! For every voice counts!"

        by progressiveinky on Tue Feb 26, 2008 at 07:12:32 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

  • It's never completely "done" (0 / 0)

    I've learned that not only is it important to have a will/trust etc. You have to keep updating it over time...

    My dad died in 2002, recently my unmarried aunt (his sister) died and some of her estate still named my dad as a beneficary. This has meant death certificates and notarized documents and many delays to get it corrected. It would have been much easier for her to remove his name- but I bet she forgot that he was listed.

    We are making changes to the guardianship for our kids now, as our original choice is no longer in a position to take our children.  sigh.

    • Guardianship (0 / 0)

      I was actually quite surprised by how many levels of guardians we needed.  I think it was 3 levels. "If X is unable or unwilling to be guardian, then X will be the guardian".

      "We've GOT to make noises in greater amounts! So, open your mouth, lad! For every voice counts!"

      by progressiveinky on Tue Feb 26, 2008 at 07:14:24 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      • Yes (0 / 0)

        Unfortunately, we have to remove our first choice from the list entirely. It's not that they would be unwilling, or unable in the traditional sense of the words. But...

        They are knee-deep in trying to help their adult child with very serious addiction and mental health issues. We are just not comfortable having our pre-teen and teen living under that same roof.  We've been putting this change off for some time (2 years), hoping it would resolve on its own, but the situation is not improving.

        • I can completely understand your dilemma (0 / 0)

          Plus in a situation like that when they are already dealing with the emotional rollercoaster they are on, they may not be able to take on one another emotional situation.  And definitely hard for you b/c obviously they were your first choice and if your situation is anything like ours, it's a hard decision who to put on that list!

          "We've GOT to make noises in greater amounts! So, open your mouth, lad! For every voice counts!"

          by progressiveinky on Tue Feb 26, 2008 at 10:56:19 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

  • I was very bad. No will. (0 / 0)

    Now, our children are 21 and 18 years old, so we dodged the bullet . . . .

  • When we lost 5 family members (0 / 0)

    in 5 months back in 2000-2001, we drew up wills and got hefty life insurance policies on both of us.  Our son was 2 then.  Since that time we've added a second son.

    We're REALLY glad we got large life insurance policies then, because in the intervening 7 years we've both been diagnosed with autoimmune disorders and insurance rates would be horrifically high.

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