Mother Talkers

Weekend Open Thread

by Elisa

Fri Aug 31, 2007 at 10:46:36 AM PDT

Attention book club lovers: I just realized that we don’t have anything lined up for the fall! Would someone like to moderate the next book club discussion? There were some interesting titles floating around this diary by Sue in Queens.

Cary Tennis is a fine example of how not all people without kids are naïve about childrearing. He recently doled out sensible advice to an uncle who was witnessing his brother walk out on his girlfriend and their five-month-old son. The uncle understandably thought his brother was an asshole, but was wondering if the father shouldn’t stick around for the sake of the child.

Tennis told him to go ahead and call his brother an “asshole.” But to conduct himself as if his five-month-old nephew could understand him.

Kids can grow up well under all kinds of circumstances. It's about how you treat the kid and who the kid is. The last thing you want to do is tell this kid his dad's an asshole. So let's just pretend that everything we're saying the kid is hearing. Now who is his daddy and why did he leave? He left because he had to. We don't know why. He had to go do something really important, and he loves us and cares about us but he couldn't live with us because he had to do something. And we love him and he's a good man and he loves us and that's just the way it is, because we don't understand everything even though we're adults and maybe it seems like we do. We don't. We don't really understand even how an electronic ignition works, or why sometimes you get "404" errors. We don't know why some toys are lame and others are your favorite. We don't know why some kids are bad and some kids are good. We don't know much, except we love you and things are going to be OK.

Something like that. You get what I'm saying? I'm saying get real and painfully honest but don't fill the kid's head full of hateful garbage.

And beware of this, too: Intense disapprobation can be an intoxicant. You can get high calling people assholes, that is. You can get high and feel powerful talking trash. That's one reason we do it. It makes us feel better. But that doesn't make it useful or productive. Except for getting stuff off your chest and moving on. So yeah, maybe your brother is an asshole. Now help me move this crib.

Like I said, the important thing is, How can the people around this child help the child, and help the child's mother?

Just food for thought. I know I am quick to call such men assholes -- and they are -- but not focused on what others can do to help their children.

This weekend, we will hang out with our Berkeley friends. Amy and I saw each other yesterday for the first time in at least a week. (Hey, that’s a long time for us!) She works full-time outside the home and I have a new baby. We were lamenting how much we missed each other. We used to see each other every single day when the boys were younger. Finally, we will have time to catch up!

What are you up to this weekend? Have a nice long weekend all!

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Tags: open thread, Cary Tennis, absentee dad, long weekend, book club (all tags)

Permalink | 46 comments

  • 3rd bday (0 / 0)

    Today is my son's third birthday. We went to the zoo this morning, will go to his fav restaraunt for dinner, and have a party at our local farm on Sunday. I can't believe he's three...my baby. Oh, and he's now potty trained. Took three days this week and he's done. Hooray!

    by GiGi on Fri Aug 31, 2007 at 11:18:20 AM PDT

  • Awesome Elizabeth Edwards diary at DailyKos (0 / 0)

    I just loved it:
    http://www.dailykos.com/...

    Small, mom-friendly political events. We don't have these in California:

    Before Elizabeth started she stopped the mothers with toddlers from trying to move back out of the way behind everyone.  "You don’t have to move back with babies at any event of mine.  I know what it’s like to have young ones.  I never would have seen a movie or attended a political event if I was trying to keep babies quiet."

    by shenanigans on Fri Aug 31, 2007 at 01:41:25 PM PDT

  • I've been off all week & I feel like a new woman! (0 / 0)

    Liza started 3rd grade this week but really only had about a day and a half of school plus meet the teacher day so I took the week off to be available to her -- we swam every day, ate our body weight in ice cream and just had a blast.  Kelly was off today and we went to the water park and met up with Liza's best friend and her family -- I sat and watched Liza take off and go on rides and slides and thought "wasn't this the 3 year old who was scared to go more than knee deep just a few minutes ago?  when did she grow up?"  I watched  her and her friend walk ahead of us deep in conversation, heads leaning in toward each other, one nodding, the other asking a question and I thought "this is when it starts, the conversations with friends that mom doesn't need to hear. That she doesn't WANT mom to hear."  I heard them eagerly planning for sleepovers and swim dates and saw them clutching eagerly to this last sweet weekend of summer.  I heard them talk ab out their teacher, make plans to try out for the basketball team (the basketball team!) and heard the excitement in their voices as a new year began and I just wanted to grab on and hold her...have her be my baby for one more moment as she hurtles headlong toward adolescence.  

    then on the walk back to the car she slipped her arm around me and said "I love you momma. thank  you for this day".... that made it all worth it!

    We'll hang round close to home the next few days as Kelly is working and then we'll hit the beach for a final day of wave riding on Monday before we prepare to welcome fall.  As sad as I am to see summer go I'm so happy to think about apple picking (at Mack's apples Elisa!!) and pumpkin carving and cheering on Liza at her soccer games.   It's gonna be a good year.

    by MKatherine1966 on Fri Aug 31, 2007 at 03:37:03 PM PDT

    • Mack's Apples! (0 / 0)

      We know and love that place!

      Have fun, Katherine and Liza!

      by tarantula on Fri Aug 31, 2007 at 03:43:57 PM PDT

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    • Awww... (0 / 0)

      What a sweet way to end the summer. And Liza must be so big! Good for you for recharging the batteries, too.

      And yes, I LOVE Mack's apples! The reference brought back memories when I was on the Londonderry High School track team -- don't worry, I really sucked -- and we used to stop there for our practices. Those are my fondest memories of New Hampshire: Running through the apple orchards and treating myself to a cup of apple cider at Mack's. You can imagine the impression this had on me after having lived in a very urban setting in Miami for 10 years. New Hampshire really is a beautiful state.

      Also, I think I was the only dork who actually liked the bus rides. It was all so picturesque, especially in the fall and winter.

      by Elisa on Fri Aug 31, 2007 at 03:45:07 PM PDT

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    • Andy Mack in the news: (0 / 0)

      See him featured on the Michael Moore site:
      http://www.michaelmoore.com/...
      another staunch Republican turned Democrat by Bushco.

      by tarantula on Fri Aug 31, 2007 at 03:46:11 PM PDT

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      • Awesome! (0 / 0)

        I wish those signs were around when I lived there. I do remember a lot of Republicans living there, but they were the economic kind that didn't want to pay taxes. That is one memory I bury as deep in my mind as possible!

        by Elisa on Fri Aug 31, 2007 at 03:50:46 PM PDT

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    • So sweet (0 / 0)

      what a wonderful post, Katie. Thanks for sharing.

      by GiGi on Fri Aug 31, 2007 at 04:56:37 PM PDT

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    • What a great post! (0 / 0)

      Sounds like both you and Liza had a great week.  I love your description of Liza with her best friend - she sounds so mature and really growing into her own personality in the world!

      by Sue in Queens on Fri Aug 31, 2007 at 04:56:41 PM PDT

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    • very cool (0 / 0)

      DD had the treat of my uncle and mother being here the last week before school. The uncle took her fishing and generally she got a lot of attention from everyone. It made me happy to see her so happy.

      It's amazing to see them suddenly so grown up. I can't believe mine is in second grade.

      My uncle was here because he had been travelling with his youngest child off to college! I could tell he was feeling much the same way - when did my kids get so big?

      by shenanigans on Fri Aug 31, 2007 at 08:42:49 PM PDT

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    • Fun! (0 / 0)

      Sounds like a great week!  We had family in town right before school started, so we did a lot of fun things too...kind of a last hurrah for summer.  I'm also looking forward to fall as it's been so HOT here.

      American Son ~ Wes Clark

      by 1plain1peanut on Sat Sep 01, 2007 at 07:40:57 AM PDT

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  • Tennis (0 / 0)

    Our biggest plan this weekend is going to the US Open on Monday.  We're all excited, and it feels like a great end to summer - with school starting the next day.

    Seth told me today that he really wants to figure out how to ride his bike without training wheels.  He's so scared of falling that I haven't been able to get him to move onto that step.  But, like his sister, I know he'll figure out when he's determined to.  Maybe this weekend?? Send him some positive, balancing, thoughts.

    by Sue in Queens on Fri Aug 31, 2007 at 04:58:56 PM PDT

    • Tell Seth Liza is right there with him (0 / 0)

      SO scared to try without her training wheels and stuck living in houses that have big hills and lots of traffic.  I have to find a way to help her find her courage...it will come...someday! in the meantime we'll live vicariously through seth!

      by MKatherine1966 on Fri Aug 31, 2007 at 05:11:05 PM PDT

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      • Park with wide paths (0 / 0)

        For Leah that was the turning point - we went to a park with wide paths, no cars, no roller bladers, and just went back-and-forth until she got it.

        Seth's problem is this is a bike-riding neighborhood, sorta.  I mean it's still congested and lots of intersections, but all the kids ride their bikes, and after school they're all in the school yard riding around.

        by Sue in Queens on Fri Aug 31, 2007 at 05:54:05 PM PDT

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      • Seemed like it took forever (0 / 0)

        And then one day, there she was, riding along on the driveway. I think daddy helped when I wasn't looking.

        by shenanigans on Fri Aug 31, 2007 at 08:45:02 PM PDT

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    • take the pedals off (0 / 0)

      I heard that taking the pedals off helps them figure out balance...worked for my DDs friend (who took her training wheels off at 4 1/2)...good luck!

      by GiGi on Fri Aug 31, 2007 at 05:30:15 PM PDT

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    • we used a towel (0 / 0)

      a large beach type towel, wrapped around their chest, under their arms, and held in back by dad [or mom, but in our case it was dad]. That way they could get the feeling of balance but he was still there to help in case they fell -- but not right on top of them. Took our son about 5 minutes to learn that way and a little longer [maybe 30] for our daughter.

      just a tip in case you want to try it.

      And I am very jealous that you get to go to the U.S. Open. My DH played competitively through college, even played in the juniors when McEnroe was coming up [DH never played McEnroe but he has a letter from a friend saying "we saw the McEnroe boy play, he's very good" -- this was when they were probably 13 or 14]. Anyway -- I would love to take DH to one of the big tournaments in a year and a half for his 50th birthday. Have a great time!

      by Lisa in Austin on Fri Aug 31, 2007 at 08:42:46 PM PDT

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  • Book Club (0 / 0)

    I'm reading "A Thousand Splendid Suns".  If anyone else wants to read it, I'd be happy to moderate (or help moderate, since I've never done it before).

    by Sue in Queens on Fri Aug 31, 2007 at 06:02:37 PM PDT

  • Finally (0 / 0)

    got my nose pierced. I mentioned it back in July and Lisa in Austin wrote,

    Good luck with the piercing! I've always wondered [but never knew anyone to ask] what is the process of keeping the piercing clean? I know how to keep newly pierced ears clean,and I have heard that you gargle with listerine after a tongue piercing -- but I have wondered about nose piercings.

    They basically told me to keep it clean, do an iodine kosher salt 'bath' 2x/day and use the special soap they gave me. It should be healed in 4 weeks. I asked him if I could still blow my nose and he said it would feel weird the first few times but not to worry about it.

    by GiGi on Sat Sep 01, 2007 at 11:28:34 AM PDT

  • We're in our new house! (0 / 0)

    I'm sooooo happy.  I haven't lived in an actual house since I left my parents' house ten or eleven years ago.  Even with everything in shambles and boxes everywhere, I'm thrilled to pieces.

    DH (very, very dear, or darling, or whatever the d really stands for), is painting dd's room today.  I'm feeling like we may be sending too strong a gender message, because partly by chance and partly by choice, her room is pink and the baby's room is blue.  

    Dd didn't want to move, and I felt it might sweeten the deal if she got to choose her own room and her own color.  She chose pink.  I tried to talk her out of it, which is silly all on its own, since in fact pink is just a color.  Still, I offered red, purple, yellow, and a lovely periwinkle, but here decision was inflexible.  So pink it is.  And the baby's room is already a perfectly lovely blue, so I'm not inclined to paint it.  Are we horribly sexist?

    To top it off, as soon as I bought the paint, Simone changed her mind.  She wants red or purple!  Sorry, love, but I already bought it, per your request.  I'm not thrilled with it, but it's in stone.  Maybe we can revisit it in a year.

    by Erin on Sat Sep 01, 2007 at 10:49:16 PM PDT

  • There's a new post (0 / 0)

    by StrangeAnimals up at DailyKos, called Saturday Child Health Diary: Wired But Disconnected.
    It's interesting and balanced, yet again. There are no links to support the stats listed, but very interesting.

    by tarantula on Sun Sep 02, 2007 at 07:01:39 AM PDT

    • Here's how we do it in our house: (0 / 0)

      We watch 1-2 hours of dvd or video per day, only in the middle of the day for a break. In the evening, everyone plays together and hangs out; there's no tv watching habit then.

      I do worry about the amount of computer time we model for our kids, but then, we use the computer to look up information (i.e. tomato horn worms, or whatever we were wondering about that day). It's the main encyclopedia in our house. And it's also for communicating with family and friends.

      by tarantula on Sun Sep 02, 2007 at 07:18:48 AM PDT

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  • lovely weekend here (0 / 0)

    My husband's nephew turned 21 on Saturday and the SIL/BIL had a massive barbeque. It was a beautiful day - around 70 degrees, and it was just so much fun. Jess had a blast running around with older kids, and we had fun with the hands-free time!! ;-) Of course, we drank waaaay too much and paid for it on Sunday, but that's life.

    by Rachel on Sun Sep 02, 2007 at 04:45:18 PM PDT

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