Mother Talkers

Talking with kids about sex

Mon Apr 16, 2007 at 10:30:34 AM PDT

The abstinence-only diary made me think about a question I've been wondering about lately:  what is the best way to discuss sex with kids at what age?

Those of you with kids elementary age or older, at what age did you tell them the "facts of life"?  Do you have any books to recommend in discussing things with them?  I have a feeling my first-grade son may be hearing things from friends at school - one friend in particular who has an older sister has said some things I've overheard - so I'm thinking it's probably getting near time to have that talk, although my parents didn't tell me about it until the third grade.

Thanks for any thoughts or comments you might have.

Tags: sex, talking to kids, sex ed (all tags)

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  • Honestly, (0 / 0)

    I never had "the talk" with my kids.  I just worked really hard at letting them know that there were no subjects that were "off limits"...they could ask about anything.  If I heard something specific, I would sometimes find ways to bring it into a conversation so that it could be discussed in a very casual manner.  

    • Follow-up (0 / 0)

      Did you give them a book to give them the general idea, or just answer questions as needed, or...?

      • Oh gosh... (0 / 0)

        its been a long time.  I know that I've used materials with diagrams.  Sometimes, a picture does paint a thousand words...but usually this would be as a follow up to questions that had been asked or discussions that had been initiated.  

        Ofcourse, I have a large family.  I am sure my older kids have "clarified" certain matters for their younger siblings.  Sometimes I hear about this, and sometimes I don't.  When I do, its often because the younger child will say something like "I heard this or that sibling say this..."  Also, when my older kids were all younger, I was still having babies.  This presented so many opportunities to pass along information.  

    • I agree (0 / 0)

      and that's the approach I've used with my kids. No question is off limits, they can ask me anything, and they'll get an honest answer.

      My daughter is 12 and I posted about MY sexual hangups and not wanting my daughter to go through what I went through. It's hard. She's very shy and so there are times when I ask her what the latest "drama" in school is, or what kids are talking about just to open the dialogue.

      • Does she like to write? (0 / 0)

        MKate has mentioned a couple of times that she and her daughter sometimes pass a journal back and forth on topics that feel sensitive. I think it's a wonderful idea.

        I worked for a year as a counselor at a middle school, a very tough age to get to open up sometimes!

        RachelD

    • That is what I did too (0 / 0)

      My oldest asked questions - he had the health classes in school which progressed in the level of information given out each year and since I would known when those classes were given, I would follow up with him. In between we talked a lot - he was/is very verbal and not shy about asking!! Of course I still giggle over his 'blue balls' question!

      Youngest is 10 and had the first puberty film in 5th grade a few weeks ago. I think this child is even MORE verbal and prone to asking clarifying questions so it's been pretty easy so far. Also I recently got two kittens, one male and one female. The female was already spayed, but we had to take in the male to be fixed this past week and we talked a lot about that process. We also talked about how the kittens were fixed vs how people can get 'fixed' :-)

    • As a young teen (0 / 0)

      I decided I wanted to be able to answer any question my kid posed honestly.  It was a guiding force in my (especially sexual) choices, wanting to keep the regrets and irresponsible moments to a minimum.

      :)  Besides, as a teen, I'm going to love watching her try and actually SAY questions that will embarass me.

      What do you mean, uh-oh? Toddler & baby pictures

      by round peg inna square hole on Tue Apr 17, 2007 at 11:41:05 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    • sex vs. romance (0 / 0)

      I read through the 36 comments.  Everyone agrees that openness is the best and I can vouch for that. My girls are 18 and 20 now and we've been through it all. Both cleared high school as virgins by choice, while many of their friends did not.  I promise, the wagging finger of morality is the worst way to go in parenting.  Here's the downside(?)of being so approachable--I know way more than I ever wanted to know about the private lives of my teen and twenty and their friends.  Kids seem to find me when they can't talk to their own parents.

      Back to the early years, we had to have our first "little talk" when they were 3 and 5, thanks to a tidbit shared by one of their friends about another little friend's single mom and boyfriend having oral sex.  They described it pretty accurately and asked if people really did that.  Yikes!

      I had to think quickly.  I thought about how poorly our society deals with sexuality, and how I wanted them to relate to it differently.  I didn't like the morality approach, besides taboos ALWAYS backfire.  So I came up with a way to discuss sex without making it bad and wrong--more of an age appropriate thing with a distinction between sex and romance that I thought was very practical.  The first step is to be sure what the child is asking, how much they already know, and what exactly they want to know right now.  I wrote an article about it, but never figured out how to get it published. Maybe it will be useful to all of you young mothers. I've copied it below.

      What I will tell you is that it helped my girls get through the years with a sense of empowerment.  They even SELF-censured what they watched and listened to on the radio!  I never had to worry about what they would be exposed to; they handled it for themselves.  After one middle school dance, they reported to me that some of the music had not been appropriate for kids, and that they were going to talk to the student council about previewing what the disc jockeys intended to play!  Nice to see your kids taking charge.

      Enjoy the article

      Sandy
      -------------
      A Framework for Presenting
      The Facts of Life

      "We need to have a little talk about..."
      Very few parents look forward to presenting the Facts of Life to their children.  While the following framework doesn’t tell you what to say about sex, it does tell you how to know what your children are ready to hear and helps you put sex and romance in perspective.  Parents who have followed this framework find the little talk to be much easier than they imagined.  See what you think.

      First, listen to your child

      Whether you introduce the conversation or your child gets to it first, listen for what your child is ready to hear.  Remember that all the details do not have to be presented at once.  

      Different children are ready to hear different things at different ages.  The best way to know what to present is by first asking your child what he/she already knows about the subject.  Listening to the child’s answer will give you clues to the child’s comfort level and let you know where to begin.  
      Regardless of the depth of your explanation or the age of the child, consider making the following two points.  They provide a structure for understanding our culture’s views on sex and for limit setting.

      Point 1:  Sex involves "privates," romance does not
      A concept that is often missing in our children’s training is that sex and romance are two different things:  sex is physical and romance is emotional.  

      For too many children, by the time they are teens, romance doesn’t exist at all or at best seems like nothing but an avenue to sex.  In the absence of romance, our teens seeking emotional fulfillment have only one choice:  sex.  Separating the two concepts for our children provides an important option throughout their lives:  romance.

      An easy way for children to tell the two apart is this:  "Sex involves ‘privates,’ romance does not."  Even very young children who know "privates" as the parts covered by a swimsuit can grasp this, and for some this is enough.  For older children, the statement can serve as an opener for introducing further details about sex like anatomically correct names for private parts or explanations of how the body reproduces.  It also provides a good way to introduce the wide range of things our culture considers sexual including verbal references to "privates," clothing that attracts attention to "privates," and behaviors that involve contact with "privates."  

      Point 2:  Sex is not for kids, romance is

      Here’s the clincher and the critical element for limit setting.  Regardless of the mixed messages we send to our children with our media, our culture is firm about one thing:  sex is not for kids.  (If you have any doubts about this, consider our child protection laws.)  "Sex is not for kids, romance is," provides a solid framework for limit setting that helps children focus on relationship not bodies.

      By preschool most children have heard the words sex and sexy creeping from the adult world into theirs.  Since we cannot insulate our children completely, "sex is not for kids, romance is," gives them a way to distinguish what is appropriate from what is not.  

      Inappropriate things include children discussing sex and privates, dressing "sexy," behaving sexually, playing with dolls sexually, listening to songs or watching shows with sexual messages, etc.  Discussing romance, dressing to look pretty or handsome, behaving affectionately, playing out romantic scenarios with dolls, listening to songs or watching shows about love and romance, etc. are fine and truly meet the child’s need to explore the world of male/female relationships without the potential for embarrassment, concern and personal stigma.  

      The limit also holds for adult-child interactions.  Inappropriate touch, inappropriate conversations initiated by adults, and other types of inappropriate sexual situations created by adults can be discussed within this framework.

      Check your child’s understanding by giving examples of appropriate and inappropriate situations and letting your child tell you which is which or allow the child to give you examples of situations he/she has noticed.  Role play with your child or simply provide sample responses to situations that may come up.  

      Examples:  
      "If a friend talks about sex you can say, ‘Sex isn’t for kids to talk about.  You should talk to your parents about that.’" or "Pretend I’m your age.  What would you say if I said, ‘Let’s get the dolls.  We can undress them and have them kiss!’"  

      Listen for an understanding of the limit in the child’s response.  If needed, coach the child toward a response like, "No.  For it to be romantic they need their clothes on when they kiss.  Lets dress them up and have them go on a date!"

      Appropriate choices

      Picture your children making appropriate clothing choices and changing the station when they hear songs or see shows with sexual messages.  Imagine them high school age, still considering a kiss as the height of romantic expression.  When our children understand our culture’s limits concerning sex, they are able to recognize what is appropriate and what is not.  Add to this an appreciation for romance and they are able to choose what is appropriate, throughout childhood and beyond, preferring life that way.  When the Facts of Life are presented in a framework that works for our children, everything can be easier than we imagined.

  • Thanks (0 / 0)

    Thanks for this topic, because I've been wondering, too. My 11yo son is, as far as I know, pretty clueless. He's sorta immature, and in the past, when questions have come up (such as what are his testicals and what are they for) the matter of fact answer my husband gave made him furiously giggle (seemingly at the ridiculousness of the answer.)

    He's going to be getting the fifth grade education soon, so I think we need to bring it up with him so he isn't blindsided, but I'm not sure how to go about that. "Ooh, good play on that Playstation game. By the way...."

  • watch nature shows (0 / 0)

    No kidding. Basic things like this have come up with my 6 year old over the past few years, and he'll ask about something and I say "well, the father, or male, puts sperm into the mom, or female, which fertilizes her egg and that's what a baby (animal) grows from in her belly." We recently watched the show, on Discovery channel, I think - that has actual film of the baby in the womb. And the same series, with the multiples. So he's actually seen birth on tv and knows babies come out of a tube between a mommy's legs.

    Really basic stuff, no elaboration until he asks a question. Which, at this point, he hasn't asked the all important, "So how does the daddy get the egg into the mommy?" I'm waiting. I figure it will get there eventually. Think I'm ready.

    SO my thinking is this - that he knows a little bit about the process, and as he needs to/wants to, I've demontrated my openness about the general subject (among many others) and figure he'll eventually ask how it actually happens.

    Now this said, he's only 6 and gets grossed out by kissing scenes in ANYTHING, so I actually think his younger brother will ask before he does. The younger guy is three and VERY curious about body parts. And motivation, ie. "Why did the thunder want to be loud?" Equally applicable to human interaction of course.

    "the "well-informed citizenry" envisioned by our framers has degenerated into a "well-amused audience." Tad Daley, Alternet - interview w/ Al Gore 05/22/07

    by cgiselle12 on Mon Apr 16, 2007 at 11:47:47 AM PDT

  • Good book (0 / 0)

    When my eldest turned seven or eight, I started previewing books. I really liked It's So Amazing by Robie Harris. It provided information at a level I thought my daughter would be comfortable with and she found it fascinating.

    • We have that book, too (0 / 0)

      and it has been great for my kids [both age 10].

      Both of my kids also have a book about puberty. My son's book is called something like B.O. and my daughter's is an American Girl book [I think] called something like Care and Keeping of You. I would go look for the books in their rooms but they are both in there now and would probably be mortified to know I'm writing about this.

      Both these books are about how one's body changes and what new steps to take to be clean. Very important.

  • It is never to early (0 / 0)

    I teach comprehensive sex-ed to 4th through 6th graders, and it is never to young to start.  I wouldn't think about it as having "the talk."  Aim for a series of conversations that lasts until adulthood.  Start in infancy, by using correct names for all the body parts.  Answer questions as they come up.  

    For kindergarten through about 3rd grade, I recommend It's So Amazing by Robie Harris.  For 4th grade through 7th, It's Perfectly Normal (also by Robie Harris) is great.  For children on the cusp of puberty, The What's Happening to My Body Book (boy or girl version) is also very good. The American Girl book on puberty is also pretty good.

    If you live near a Unitarian or United Church of Christ congregation, you may want to find out if they teach the Our Whole Lives classes.  Our Whole Lives is a great sexuality curriculum with classes for K/1, 4-6, middle school and high school.  Many congregations open their classes to the community.

    • my experience with my own (0 / 0)

      kids agrees with what you write.  my kids would follow me into the bathroom at young ages which always opened up discussions of bodily functions especially with my daughter as it related to periods and tampons, pads, etc.

      i sometimes use humor to relieve the tension that can be felt when sex is the topic...we also have the framework that our kids can ask us anything.

      even with all that, there are times that they may still feel awkward and/or they decide they do not want to discuss a particular topic.  but we keep trying and use opportunities when they become available.

      Several years ago there were lots of rumors that girls were having oral sex with boys in middle school both when my son was in middle school and again when my daughter was there.  One day while driving my daughter home from school after reading or hearing yet another horror story about really young girls doing some incredibly provocative things, I said "M, what do you think about all the rumors and stories about girls giving boys blowjobs at school?"  She blinked a couple of times and said, "Mom what's a blowjob?"  To which I  felt compelled to explain, and then she said "Mom, do you do that to Dad?"  

      This is when a really good sense of humor comes in handy.

    • "correct names" (0 / 0)

      We use "penis" and "testicles" (like when we get out of the shower and she points at Papa)...but is there a correct name for female genetalia?  She's not really dealing with her "vagina" and there's nothing to me that really seems to encompass "that whole general area down there."

      We've chosen "yoni", and then use "tushie" and "butt" for her backside and "boobies" for breasts (she will point to hers on command, just like knees and feet and ears).

      What do you mean, uh-oh? Toddler & baby pictures

      by round peg inna square hole on Tue Apr 17, 2007 at 11:50:06 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      • I struggle with that (0 / 0)

        I've told my daughter vagina, but I always feel weird about it, because it's inaccurate.  I could say vulva, but it seem so ridiculous.  But that's what the whole area is called!  Isn't it funny how I don't like that word, but I never worry about whether or not I like the words for elbow or neck.

        • LOL (0 / 0)

          Too true.  I don't like "bottom" because that doesn't do justice to her cute little tush, so "tush" it became.  We do "cheekies" too, so I'm not overly worried.

          ONe of my other hippie Berkeley mom used "yoni" because it is a positive word in Hindi, having to do with beauty and flower and sacredness.  I figure if my daughter thinks of her genitals as sacred and precious, I'm okay with that.  LOL

          What do you mean, uh-oh? Toddler & baby pictures

          by round peg inna square hole on Tue Apr 17, 2007 at 12:19:28 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

        • I have the same problem! (0 / 0)

          I've taught Jess to say "vulva", but I'm more likely to say "crotch." Why does vulva seem so hard to say?

          • We say vagina (0 / 0)

            in our house. No, it is not technically correct, but its the best we've got...even my speech delayed DS says 'pee pee" for penis and "va va" for vagina.

          • because it sounds like a car...jk. (0 / 0)

            How about what Oprah says "Va-jay-jay"....I think that's hilarious.

            But my kids learned all the "correct" terms and then you know the story when my son said "Mom my scrotum itches" as we stood in the excrutiatingly long line at the grocery store...He was only 3 --- too funny.

  • I've been thinking about this, too (0 / 0)

    Right now I've been answering the few questions dd has answered honestly--it's easy because she's three.  Mostly I give her the correct name for body parts, except for "breast" because the word she made up is just too damn cute.  But even then I've used the corect word occasionally just so I can feel like a better mom.  

    I haven't read it yet, but I plan to read the book "From Diapers to Dating" for some guidance.

  • what they already know(misinformation) (0 / 0)

    My son is only 8, but he already tries to french kiss me - because he "knows" this is how grownups kiss. And when they are in love, they get naked and get into bed together!  I try to keep the conversation around biology, because he likes learning anatomy and looking at anatomy books.(He always has, from when he was very small.)So I just keep increasing the information there.

    I got the Whole Lives series online but have not used it more than my own common sense and openness. It is a balance to me because he is interested in things and I don't want to overload him with stimulating information.

    I was never given a "talk" nor did school teach us anything of value back in the day, so this is one area where I am an improvement over my upbringing no matter what I do!

    Oh, I have had to explain to him not to say"That's so gay" and to make sure he understands that it is not to be used as an insult equivalent to calling something stupid. He did not know what it meant, but he does understand that some people of the same sex fall in love and make families.

    • French kiss (0 / 0)

      LOL - my almost 8yo did this once or twice too - acted out giving an open-mouth kiss.  Guess he watches too much "Teen Nick" on TV.

      He's also very interested in breasts - especially mine  lol - when I give him a big hug, sometimes he'll say "Mom, your breast is squishing my eye" and then look to see if I react to him saying that word!

  • My kids is still in diapers but (0 / 0)

    as a teacher, I really believe sooner is better.

    Sex ed isn't just about intercourse and the talk isn't just a one time thing.

    It begins with learning the names of body parts and that some parts are private.

    At the 1st grade level, your son should know the proper names for male anatomy and have a reasonable grasp of how boys are different from girls.  He should understand that boys grow into men/girls into women and that those changes will be more than just getting bigger (body hair, deeper voice).

    He should have limited understanding of pregnancy, that it takes a mom and a dad to make a baby (but not necessarily how), babies grow inside a special place in a woman's belly (uterus or womb) and that mother can feed babies with their breasts.

  • Many small talks (0 / 0)

    DD15 and DS7 have different needs, of course, but the talks are sort of ongoing and of the "no topic is off limits" variety.  My son is mostly interested in anatomy right now - looking at and talking about his boy parts, etc.  My only "issue" with him is he loves to say the word "BREAST" - and then giggle - I just hope he doesn't do that at school!

    My daughter is right in the middle of it - with friends who've already had oral sex, and a couple who've had intercourse I think.  My DD is pretty open with me, but I'm sure there are things I don't hear about too, so sometimes I just bring it up when it comes up in the news.

  • I plan to be very open (0 / 0)

    I want sex to be a regular topic of conversation in our house, and plan to get a lot of age-appropriate books about the topic.  My parents must have told me the basics, probably when I was 6 and my mom was pregnant.  But as I got older I definitely didn't feel comfortable going to them if I had questions.  I don't think this had anything to do with how they handled it, but more my own issues and feeling uncomfortable.  My kids are still little, but I'll definitely answer questions as they come and provide written materials when they're older in case they're more comfortable consulting a book than their parents.  Still, I hope that we'll be able to have discussions frequently as they get older so they know it's not a taboo topic.

    • That's my plan too (0 / 0)

      I think it should be done in an age appropriate manner and I also think it depends on the child as to how much information they hear and when.  I also agree that I don't ever want it to be a taboo topic.  

      • Regarding age-appropriateness (0 / 0)

        One thing I've heard is that with young kids you should just answer the question as simply as you can, and if they're not satisfied, they'll keep asking.  So "Where do babies come from?" can be answered with: "They grow inside the mommy."  If that isn't enough information, the kid will continue to ask, but you might be able to stop there (for the time being, at least).
        With older kids I may err on the side of too much information since I wouldn't be as confidant they would continue to ask questions.

        • An example: (0 / 0)

          When my oldest was in kindergarten, his teacher told me that while the kids were lined up at the water fountain, my son announced that he had sex.  She told him he hadn't had sex, but he was insistent.  In talking to him about what he meant he said that one of the girls in his class was sexy and she was his girlfriend.  His thinking was that if she was hs girlfriend, and she was sexy that meant he had sex.  So the conversation went something like this:  First, you're not allowed to have a girlfriend until your older.  Second, we don't call girls sexy.  You can say she's pretty or beautiful, but sexy is a grown up word.  Third, that's not even what sex mean.  So, he asks, "what does sex mean?"  My reply "sex is how mommy's and daddy's make babies."  He responds with a very knowing "Ooohhhh... now I understand."  End of conversation.  He wasn't interested in the details of intercourse or human reproduction.  He just wanted to know what the word meant.

  • What I've noticed (0 / 0)

    Talking to other friends is that whenever parents feel it is time to start sex ed, it is too late and the kid has already received some (usually erroneous) information from a peer.

    What we do is bathe with her, include her genitals in the "eyes, ears, mouth etc" schtick and tell her what ours are when she asks (during bath time or bed time).  Of course, she's only 20 months old, so I feel we're on track.

    • I've been surprised (0 / 0)

      Many of my friends seem really uncomfortable with the prospect of talking about sex with their kids, even when it's just naming body parts.  I want to make sure my kids get the factual information from me.  Perhaps they'll be the kids in the class people go to for info, but hopefully they'll at least have the right information.  One reason I hear from people about holding off on answering all questions is because they don't want their kids to talk about it at school.  As if human reproduction is some huge secret.  

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